Women Like Me Stories & Business

Jenn Wint - Confessions of a PR pro: it’s not about bus benches

• Julie Fairhurst • Episode 159

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Your story is more than a tagline; it’s the engine of trust. We sit down with PR strategist Jenn Wint to unpack how small businesses turn lived experiences into narratives that win attention, earn credibility, and convert without feeling like ads. Jenn traces her path from real estate development to nearly two decades in PR, then gets practical about the difference between marketing and earned media, why perfect stories fall flat, and how to find the details only you can tell.

We explore the discovery process she uses to help founders surface a distinctive 'why,' the ways a story should evolve from a scrappy startup to team-led growth, and the specific tactics that drive traction: targeted pitches, thoughtful follow-ups, and collaborations that share audiences and backlinks. 

Jen offers a grounded reframe for visibility, especially for women entrepreneurs reluctant to self-promote, by anchoring every post, interview, or panel to service: make the story about the outcome your audience needs. We also explore local versus national angles, timely hooks like awareness days and seasonal trends, and simple tools like Google Trends to validate what people actually search for.

PR is a long game, and Jenn is clear about how to measure what matters when trust, not clicks, is the currency. She shares what to do when pitches fall flat, why consuming the media you want to be featured in is non-negotiable, and how to start with a zero-budget approach by defining a single call to action, crafting one or two signature stories, and placing them where your audience already pays attention. If you’ve been stuck between doing more and saying more, this conversation gives you the map and the momentum to move.

Enjoyed the episode? Follow the show, share it with a friend who needs a nudge to tell their story, and leave a quick review so more small business owners can find us.

Website: https://wintcommunications.com/
Free PR Tips Download: https://wintcommunications.com/free-pr-tools

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jenn_wint/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jenn-wint/

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Who is Julie Fairhurst?
Julie Fairhurst – Speaker, Author, and Founder of Women Like Me

Julie Fairhurst is a champion for women’s empowerment and the founder of the Women Like Me Book Program. Since 2019, she has published 30 books and 300+ true-life stories—at no cost to the writers—giving women a platform to heal, inspire, and reclaim their power. Dedicated to breaking generational trauma one story at a time, Julie’s mission is to uplift women emotionally and financially, helping them create better lives for themselves and their families.


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SPEAKER_01:

Welcome everyone to another episode of Women Like Me Stories in Business. I'm your host, Julie Fairhurst, and I am so excited to have this lady with us here today. If you have a small business, are you in business at all, really, you may want to really dive into this podcast because there's going to be lots of helpful tips for you. Okay, so let me introduce Jen Whip. She's the founder of WIMP Communications and has uh made it her mission to have small businesses tell stories of quick that breathe the spark of connection. And with October being small business month, uh there's no better way to explore how narratives create brands, how vulnerability becomes strength, and how every entrepreneur carries a story worth hearing. So you guys hang in. This is going to be amazing. Thank you, Jen, so much for being willing to be on the podcast. Yeah, thank you for having me. I'm really excited to chat.

SPEAKER_00:

And we're small business months, so this is perfect.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, yes. Okay. So what first drew you into PR storytelling and how did winter communications come to be? That might be a lot. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00:

Good question. It's funny because I um, yeah, I have, well, I mean, if you want to go way back, I have uh a degree in sociology and English. So I've always been really interested in language and in human behavior. So I think that was kind of the root of it. But I always sort of saw myself going down like more of a more a marketing path. But uh, but I was working in in, I started my career in real estate development um and architecture. And I just I had a mentor in one of the early, in my very early jobs, who managed the PR for the a real estate company that I was working for. And I just loved the way that she could take a, you know, a house listing and turn it into a story. Um, and sometimes that was about, you know, the person selling it. Sometimes that was about the neighborhood. And those were the stories that really interested me about like, sure, this is a house, but like you're not just buying a house, you're buying a lifestyle, you're buying an experience, you're buying the coffee shops and the, you know, that all that the neighborhood had to offer. So that just kind of led me very early into PR. I've been doing it for almost 20 years now. Wow. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. And when did you start your your uh communications company?

SPEAKER_00:

So I started, um, I left kind of the traditional corporate world about 15 years ago. So it's been, it's been quite a while that I've been out on my own. And then I was doing uh still a lot of kind of larger, larger businesses, corporate contracts, big events, things like that. And then just in the last like sort of five years, I've really been drawn into small businesses, um, you know, working with founders, working with entrepreneurs, um I work with some authors, like just kind of smaller, independent businesses that don't have like, don't have the need and don't have the budget for like a full PR campaign, right? Like they don't need the full press release launch, like all these things, but they they have these really rich stories and they have this desire for visibility and uh and and the need to connect with their audience. So um I think it's been about two, two, three years that I've that I've really been focused on small businesses.

SPEAKER_01:

Perfect. And so can you define story for business?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. So I would I always say sort of like your your PR and your story is is your why. Um and PR is is earned. Um it's earned and owned, really. Like it's your website, your blog, your social for sure, but it's also earned. Um, like when I uh spoke to you of being on this podcast, you know, you kind of said, Great, Jen, I'd love to chat with you. So I sort of earned that opportunity. Like uh this isn't an ad where you're saying, you know, book now with WID communications. That's sort of like more marketing advertising, whereas PR is more earned. And to earn something, you need trust and you need sort of that why behind it. Um, because if I said to you, like, I'd love to put an ad on your website, you know, here's a few hundred dollars, it's a different transaction than like I would like to have a conversation with you that that talks about my business and why I do what I do. And I think you're gonna be a little more careful when you um, you know, like if this interview goes really badly, you're not gonna post it, right? Right. Hopefully it won't. I don't think it will, but um, but yeah, it's really it's sort of that that connection piece and stories connect us, right? Like you want to buy from businesses, uh, buy from uh, you know, buy products and and and and services from from stories and people that you connect with.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, for sure. Absolutely. It's they have to know you, like you, and trust you. And that's a difficult thing to do over a computer screen.

SPEAKER_00:

Totally.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, it really is. Yeah, for sure. So what about? So how do you put story and identity together? I know that it's I know that definitely the why is important, but how do you help a business un uh uncover or rediscover their narrative?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, I so when I kick off with a client, we have this like kind of generally goes around two hours, really big discussion about sort of what led you to do what you do. Um, why do you do what you do? And and I ask often, like, what problem are you solving? Because everybody gets into what they what they do and what they love to do because they wanted to help someone. You know, most people I work with wanted to, it's never I wanted to make money. It's always I wanted to help or I wanted to solve. Um, so we kind of we look at that and then and then we go through like what are the really what are the really unique stories? You know, what what makes your business really different? Um, because I also tell clients all the time, nobody wants a perfect story, right? That's not interesting. I started my business, I planned it all out, it went really well, I made lots of money, and here I am. No one's gonna connect with that. That's not a real story, you know what I mean? So um, when it comes to identity, it's sort of pulling out like what makes you really unique, and then as well, who's your audience, right? Like if you're trying to connect with people who love gardening, you're gonna wanna use that that part of your story if that's your your audience. Um, you also all small businesses have that kind of business story as well as that origin story, and then as well, that story that's gonna really connect with their audience.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, absolutely. I was uh a real estate agent, so we have a little connection there for 36 years. I just retired a couple years back to do women like me full-time. And and I would tell tell my because I had a team, and I would say, you guys, you can't market to a first-time buyer it with an with an advertisement for uh a senior couple or a couple, you know, every every buyer is or cut or client is unique. And so if you're not speaking to them, you can't just speak to everybody. You in once. You have to figure out who that is and then speak to them directly. You can always, you know, market to whoever you want, but but if you just do one ad that's sort of generic, you might miss everybody.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, yeah. It's about that connection, right? You know, that that piece of what what it, you know, is it a school zone that may have no interest to some groups, but it'd be a major factor for other people.

SPEAKER_01:

So yes, yeah, yeah. Or it may be a real turnoff for some people. Yeah. They don't want to live near a school. They've been there, done that. Totally.

unknown:

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh dear. Okay, so evolution of stories. So, how do you see a founder story or brand uh narrative changing over time, maybe from startup to growth?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, definitely. And I think the the founders that, you know, I was having this conversation with someone the other day, we were saying, how rich do you have to be before you forget what it's like to not be rich? And I think that um the founders that really remember where they've come from and the work that it took to get there, um, I think the the ones that remember that part of their story have the richest stories. And I mean rich in content. Um but yeah, I think, and I also think that people want to be inspired by your story as well. So if you, you know, started as a solopreneur, launched your business, and now you're leading a team of 25 people, that's really inspiring for someone who's still at that, you know, in that early growth phase.

SPEAKER_01:

Right.

SPEAKER_00:

Um, and I think the founders that share vulnerably how they got there. And most of the good stories that I hear are about building those teams. They're about saying, like recognizing what you don't know and finding those experts and relying on them and getting as much information from the people around you that you can. Um, those are kind of the interesting stories. Yes. And then of course the the bumps along the road as well, make those stories relatable, right? Because we've all had those bumps.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. Let me ask you. So so let's say I was starting in real estate and I came to you and and you said, well, why are you doing it? And I said, because a lot of a lot of them say this, well, I want to make a lot of money. How are you gonna help me gather my story when I'm saying, well, I'm I I entered real estate because I wanted to make a lot of money? So what are you gonna do? Like, how do you like how do because obviously we can't, nobody's gonna go, you know, yeah, we'll work with Julie because she wants to make a lot of money. But so how do you, how do you like what how do you help me to shape a real story?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and I I worked with a couple of realtors. Um, and I I really like working with realtors because what I like about them is they are, I mean, a lot of them do work in teams for sure, but yeah, but there are a lot of realtors to choose from, whether you're you're picking, you know, anywhere in Canada, whatever, there's there's a lot of realtors to pick from. It's a very crowded space. Yes, a lot of, what do you say, a lot of fish in the pond or whatever? And so I say to them, like, you sure you want to make a lot of money, and that's great. We all need to make money to make our businesses successful. That I think is a really important part of a conversation when it comes to the why. But what I find with that point is it's not the differentiator, right? Because if you took 20 realtors, they were all in the kind of area that you were looking to um, you know, to purchase a home in, and you said to all of them, okay, who here wants to make money? You're gonna get 20 hands up, right? Of course. But then so you need to dig and find like what's that unique story? And I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to make money from your career. Like I said, that's that's beautiful. No, of course. You do. Yeah. So what is what is your point of difference? Did you move a lot when you were a child? I was talking to this mortgage broker that I was working with actually, and about 90 minutes into our conversation, and she was so passionate about helping people invest in property. And and about 90 minutes into our discovery call, I really she told me a story about how the first apartment that she had ever purchased had burnt down. And that and the lesson she had learned from that. And I'm like, light bulb moment, you know, why? And I said, Do you talk to clients about this? And she said, No, I've never talked to clients about this. So, this is such an interesting story because that's a really personal, painful thing to go through that that has really informed the way that you approach the work that you're doing. Yes. That's that a lot of people don't have, you know, and I'm not saying it makes her better, but it makes her uh there's points of connection there.

SPEAKER_01:

So yeah, and and makes her stand out as being a little bit possibly different.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely. Yeah. So I would work with a realtor and and and I always say, say more, say more about that. Tell me more about that until we get to something that is unique. And then I think the next challenge for a realtor is once you've kind of figured out what your unique points are and why somebody might want to work with you, how do we then communicate that? You know, and and for realtors, a lot of it is their social media, their um, you know, their website. And then how can we take your story and some of the work that you're doing and get some of that earned media? You know, where what other blogs can we have you talked about on or guest blogging or podcasts or mainstream media? How do we kind of position you as a thought leader in this very busy space?

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, yes, that's brilliant. Yes, very good. Very good. Okay, so with um, so with October being small business month, how can we shine a lot a spotlight on our business? And how can we, how can we use like what I guess we move in just from what you were just saying. So how can we leverage the storytelling?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and and that is uh, you know, it's a tough question because again, there's a lot of stories out there. There's a lot of small businesses out there. And, you know, we can we can pitch, you know, figure out your your story, figure out where your audience is, pitch your story to media. Absolutely. And and a lot of the time that, you know, I I'm seeing clients with with small businesses who are seeing a lot of success in the media space because of a well-crafted pitch and because of their persistence, and because they're really doing their research and nailing the people that they're talking to. But the other place that I'm seeing a lot of success for small businesses is through collaborations. And maybe to go back to the real estate, um, the real estate example, if if you're kind of a realtor who's like, I just don't think I'm gonna be the spokesperson on global TV, or I just don't think I'm gonna be the spokesperson in a national newspaper, can you find a local uh mortgage broker? Can you find a local uh property um property assessment person or or company? And how can you, because these days we all have a platform, you know? So how can you use the platform of others to access the audience that you want to access? Get those nice backlinks, you know, if they're linking to you from their website, that kind of thing, but also have someone else sort of tell your story. And does that look like an Instagram live? Does that look like a blog swap? Does that look like a conversation like you and I are having? Like how can you use the success of others to not only um you know make things easier for your audience because they're going, oh geez, there's a mortgage broker, a property assessor, and a realtor and maybe an interior designer all in one, all in one place. If I like all of them, that's a one-stop shop.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Um, as well as have some different platforms to tell your story to access a very values-aligned audience.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I think that I think that a lot of people get kind of stuck there. And I think that it's it's not just necessarily uh don't want to be the spokesperson, but they don't know what to do. Yeah. They don't just don't they're they don't know what to do. And and really from my own experience and and being in that industry for such a long time, and not just that industry, but anywhere where we have to personally promote ourselves, like that is that's hard. Like I remember when I had my first picture on a bus bench. I'm not even joking, I couldn't drive down that street and look at it. I just couldn't drive, I couldn't do it, couldn't do it. I knew I had to have it, but I couldn't do it. And so how maybe as women, uh, well, I mean, how do we overcome that in business? Because we're we're not we're not being seen, right? We're we're kind of hiding. So how how would how can we overcome that?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and that's a great point. Men don't have this problem. No, they don't. They're driving by the bus stop even when it's not anywhere near where they need to go.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and I I have this challenge with you know, female clients where they, you know, they've got they've got a great business, they've got a great story, they've done the work, they've sent the pitch, they've got the interview, and now the interview's published. And I say, Oh, you know, I saw your interview was published. How come you haven't shared that in your newsletter on your LinkedIn? They're like, oh, you know, I'm just feeling a bit nervous. And it's like, but you worked so hard to get that.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

But I always say to them, go back to the why. Like, you don't have to say, like, oh, look at me, I'm on a bus. Like, you can say, I I purchased or I'm really excited to be on this bus to help young families access my services because I'm the expert for young families. I know school zones like the back of my hand, and this bus stop is going to help me help families find the best home.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Like, think it just goes back to that why are you doing what you're doing? And yeah, and people can't help you, they can't work with you, they can't promote you if they don't know about you. That's right. You're doing a, in a way, a disservice to your community and your audience and your potential customers if you're keeping what you're doing really quiet.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, we we used to call it the secret agent. Yeah, don't be a secret agent. Yeah. You're not supposed to be a secret agent to get ahead. Exactly. Yeah. So um local versus broad stories. So how do you balance deeply local? Um, so like the neighborhood community stories, uh, or the reaching or getting them to reach that wider audience, or even should they be reaching that wider audience?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, I think it just goes back to like what is your if you have a product, for example, that you can can be purchased online and you can shift it out anywhere, your reach is a bit broader than again, a realtor who is selling in a specific neighborhood. So I think it's sort of like what are you, you know, who are you looking to to tap into to connect with and to access? Um and also it it shifts your story a little bit, right? Because there is a huge uh, there's a huge desire in Canada right now to shop Canadian, to buy local. Um, there's there's a lot going on with uh, you know, with obviously all the tariffs and all these things. So so I think using that messaging is really important. So if you're marketing yourself in, let's say Vancouver or the Lower Mainland or BC, that's the messaging you want to use. But if you are pitching like a national gift guide, you'd like to say you're a Canadian product as opposed to a product from British Columbia. Yeah, it's just sort of tweaking that narrative to fit um to fit the audience.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes. I it just you keep going back to the audience, the audience. So it um it you can do all the marketing and all the grunt work getting it together. But if you don't know your audience inside and out like the back of your hand, you're just throwing stuff at the wall and hoping it sticks.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And I when people say, Well, I'm not sure exactly who my audience is, I say when you talk about your business, what are the questions that people are asking? Who's asking more questions and who's going, oh, okay, that's cool. And and you know, finding someone else to chat with. You can really learn a lot just from you know, from from answering questions and and asking your own questions.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah. It's so important though to figure to figure that out. Definitely. So can you share a time when just to give our audience a little bit of an idea, what happens if you share a pitch that doesn't land?

SPEAKER_00:

I have a lot of experience with that. You have to have a bit of tough skin to be in public relations because like you send a lot of pitches that don't land. Um and a lot of that just looks like radio silence. Um, and I think the way that I that I manage that is I I I completely deeply understand that these journalists have very busy inboxes. They also have the mandate coming from their, you know, their production team and whatnot. So I'm if I send a, you know, send a pitch, and generally, and I say this to a lot of my clients, almost all the time your first pitch is not going to be the one that lands. Because we all do it. You read the email, you know, the journalist is reading the email, they say, Oh, yeah, that's a good story. I like the sound of that. And then it, you know, goes somewhere else. So what I focus a lot on with um with a lot of my PR coaching clients is the follow-up, because the follow-up is, you know, where you can have an impact for sure. And uh and so in that, you know, I'm curious if you had a chance to read my email, wanted to follow up and and not remind you that it's small business month, but say, you know, October small business month, did you get a chance to think about the pitch I had sent, that kind of thing? That's where you're gonna get your traction. Yes. And sometimes it's not the right fit, which is why we send lots of pitches.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, exactly. Yeah, and that's the thing is that don't be afraid of a no because as as cliche as it sounds, every no is closer to a yes. And it is true.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01:

It is true.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. And you know, in in my industry, you get a lot of no's and you get a lot of like nothing, no responses. And that's just it's just how it goes. And uh, and you get better at figuring out how to get less no's, but there's always gonna be no's, or not right now, or maybe later, or you know, sometimes I get emails back saying this is such a great story, but it's not the right fit, you know.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, so yeah, exactly. Um, so how do you measure whether a story worked? So if I put my business story out there into the world, how would I be figuring that it works? What what might I be seeing happening? Or yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, that's a definitely a challenge in uh in the public relations industry because when you put an ad out, you'll get metrics, you'll get ROI. Uh, you know, if you do a social media ad, you know how many people clicked on it, you know what province they're in, you know, you know, they drank water after they clicked. Like you get a lot of information about these people. Whereas when the um when the currency that you're working with is trust, it's a lot harder to measure. So I think there's a statistic which I I believe it was somebody had to see something seven times, and then it was 11 times. And I actually did a workshop this past weekend, and someone said, I think it's 16 times now that has to see something before they take action or before that message has any impact. Yeah, so it is the the kind of PR coverage that I'm helping clients get is part of a bigger puzzle. Um and and it, you know, it is just one factor. And and it's people, I have some people that say, you know, I need to have the ROI. And I say, well, maybe marketing and advertising is a better fit for for your business right now. Like pursuing storytelling isn't isn't for everyone. Do you know what I mean? Yes, and like we can use this podcast as a great example. Like, we're having a great conversation, we're gonna post it, we're gonna share it, people will watch it, people will enjoy it, but like I don't I I wouldn't expect that either one of us would get a phone call and say, like, I'd like to work with you because I listen to this. Right.

SPEAKER_01:

Well, so true, so true. And and I know that because two of my boys are still in real estate. They took over the business. And I always tell them it's they're gonna see you will, they need to see you over here, and then they need to see you over there, and then they need to get this from you in the mail, and then they need to see that over there. And so, yeah, you're right. I had I I've never looked into how many times they need to see you, but I I would say, especially with our social media, probably 16's getting there.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, yeah, definitely. And like I said, when trust is the currency, it's really hard to measure. Yeah. And so I think like I would never encourage anyone to put all their eggs in the PR basket. I think you need to be using other um, you know, other communication methods and other marketing tools. Um, and this is one of them.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. What about trends? Can you do you know what's going on out there in the world of whatever it would be for just for thinking more for um what we need to do to uh enhance our businesses or get more reach. What are the trends out there right now?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, so there's there's two kind of buckets. There's the there's industry industry trends, and I've recently been playing a lot with Google Trends, which is so interesting. You stick your your search terms in to see what people are actually searching. So there's sort of what is trending, and then there's your market trends. And I think I've got that right. And like your market trends might be that uh, well, a great trend over like one that's very um prominent right now is people are shopping local. So you'll see a lot of products that have actually been made in Canada for 50 years are now putting a Canadian, um, a Canadian flag or a maple leaf on their product. So that's kind of a market trend that that people are now telling that local story where before that wasn't so important. Um, whereas like something that is uh trending right now might be, you know, Taylor Swift, Life of a Showgirl. And you know, like I'm wearing an orange sweater and and you know, she's her new album is all about orange. So maybe I'm trying to, if I'm, you know, this is probably it's not even the right shade of orange, so that's not a great example. But I understand what you mean though. You can tap into those sort of trends. And then another thing that I always encourage clients to um to have a look into is uh is these like, I don't even know like what the term would be, like these national days. Like I pitched a story once that was about national sibling day because I was working with a female entrepreneur who had a sister who also had a successful business, and and I had spoken to the sister and I thought, you two have such a cool dynamic the way that you support one another in your businesses. I pitched a publication. I said, I don't know if you're aware, but you know, in three weeks it's National Sibling Day. Did you want to do a profile on these two women? And I said, Yeah, that's a great idea. So I think today is actually uh uh I think it's celebrate your local bookshop day. Oh so tapping into those kind of like is is really important. And and you know, I'm where appropriate, I'm always a big fan of jumping on things that are trending because you can insert yourself into theware of those larger market trends. Yes. You know, are people wanting more online events? Like are people uh looking to shop locally? And these are things that evolve slower and over time. But definitely like the first thing I say to people when they say, Oh, how do I like you know start pursuing PR? And I say, You have to consume media. If you want to be in a local paper, you should read the local paper, you know? Yes, so kind of it just doing that education piece is that is really important.

SPEAKER_01:

That's such a that is such great advice. Absolutely. It it um yeah, so often because we're such we're in a society now of like this minute, that minute, and we're not necessarily doing the research that possibly we should be doing. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah. What advice would you give to newbies? So they've got zero PR budget, but they need to do something. What are yeah, what are some steps that you could advise that you could give them?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and when people come to me and they say, like, I I want to pursue some PR, I say, Do you have a call to action? Because before you pursue, you know, storytelling, visibility, and getting yourself out there, you have to know what what you want from your audience. And so, you know, sometimes people say, like, well, I'm thinking about writing a book. So I want to do some PR. And I say, well, what is your call to action? Because you don't have a book to sell, you know, it's not ready yet. But that doesn't mean that you that doesn't mean you can't do PR. I mean, maybe I would recommend working on the book a little bit first, but like, do you have a newsletter that you want people to join? Do you have, are you trying to get people interested? Is your book about, I don't know, trying to think of something coming up. Is your is your book about uh Thanksgiving? Thanksgiving, sure. Um, do you want to start this conversation about this thing that you're going to be exposing or writing about or something like that? Like, what is the call to action? And until you have one that's strong and clear, then maybe there's a couple steps to do before you start your PR. Um, but once you've got your call to action, and whether that is I'm trying to grow my newsletter, I want to tell my story, I want to, you know, I'm an executive coach who wants clients. Like my call to action is literally book a session with me. Um, or my call to action is, you know, buy my product, buy my um, you know, buy my scrunchie or buy my skincare line. Um, you know, figure out what your call to action is and then start start telling your story. It's it's kind of as simple as that. But uh, but before you go out with a bunch of messaging, figure out what you want, what action do you want your audience to take when they hear your story?

SPEAKER_01:

That's fabulous advice. Very, very good advice. So if a business could remember, could be remembered for one story, even 10 years from now, what kind of story would you think that would be?

SPEAKER_00:

I think it goes back to that why, like that they're that they're they've created something to to solve a problem or help a help a person or help a business. Yes. And and that's you know, that's what they're doing. Like if you think about all the the interesting, you know, even like like Netflix, for example, started as I think mail out DVDs. And then they thought, you know, people don't want to wait at their mailbox anymore. How do we how do we go to the next phase? And then, you know, online streaming is now basically a how many of us, most of us, consumer our media. Um and I think like, you know, using Netflix as an example, they really uh they really revolutionized their industry through kind of taking a big leap and taking a chance and being a really small kind of startup. Um so I mean, I'd love to think of a local example that I can use. Um, sorry, go ahead. No, I was just gonna say it goes back to that that problem solving. What problem are you solving for clients and how are you kind of being one step ahead of what people are wanting?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. I was just gonna say uh one thing about the Netflix is that um I've recently learned, just I'm I've been in doing some some stuff, but anyway, I've recently learned that, and I didn't realize this, but it makes complete sense. So I sp I I spoke to a producer, and she had uh a number one, she did a movie. Uh she lives in Australia, and so she did this movie in Australia. It went over very, very well. It was shown in Australia, but it was also shown in a c in a couple of other countries, which didn't end up being in Canada or the US. And um, and I thought, you know, how interesting because Netflix is like I thought to myself, well, that's interesting because I can't even find it on my Netflix. And I thought they they know who they're marketing to. That story's gonna work really well in Australia, and I think Israel, I can't remember what other country she said it was. She was shocked that it was in these other countries. But why didn't they play it in Canada? Why didn't they put it in the US? It wouldn't have, for whatever reason, they decided that that we're not typically the audience for that movie that she produced and put and but they but it was for there. And I thought, oh yeah, like there's imagine the stuff we're not even seeing.

SPEAKER_00:

And they would have, I suppose, all of the analytics, right? Like they would have, you know, Australians love a good murder mystery, or they love, you know, this, and Canadians are are more skewed to this. So yeah, it's it's very interesting.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and it really does go back though that to what what you were saying in the very beginning of our conversation, which is you have to know who your audience is. Yeah. You just can't can't craft a marketing plan, you can't really craft your, of course, your business story without really knowing who you're going to be talking to.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And unfortunately, I mean, unfortunately, for small businesses, we don't have access to all the data that Netflix would have. So we're kind of out going to a networking event or, you know, showing up at an online networking event and and sit and listening and asking questions. So we do.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. It's just so interesting. It's just, I it's just, it's been a fascinating conversation. And I, you know, one of the things I love so much, I know I've said this before with certain guests, but is when I get so much out of it. So I have been writing notes. I have all sorts of notes that I can take back and help to my my community that I work with. So uh, Jen, it was um it was great. You're very, you're definitely a wealth of knowledge, and I appreciate you sharing. Is there anything at all that you would like to share with our audience before we close? Any words of wisdom or calls to action or oh, just so just so everybody knows, we're gonna have all of Jen's uh information and links to how you can find her in the show details of the podcast, the YouTube video. So um, so you will be able to connect with her, but you can still give a call to action if you want to.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, I mean, I feel like I could, I could go on and on. I just I love these conversations and I love um so many of these conversations happen behind closed doors. And so I love the fact that you're making them, you know, you're making them accessible and making them um available to to other business owners. I think that is just so important. Um, I get I think my call to action, I mean, my like you said, you'll share all the links. I have uh um like a little five, five tips to grow your your business, five PR tips, uh, which I'll share the link to. I would love it if some of your audience downloaded that. Um, I would love to connect on social. And I also have a I have a uh button on my website where you can you can book a call. It's a 20-minute call if you want to just chat and even find out if your business is in a good place for PR. Um, I love having those conversations. But I think my my call to action, if you wanted to like get started right now in the next five minutes, is like do your research and think about where your story could be told. And one of the tips I give is like Google your headline. Think about if you're um, if you could write the story and have it printed in, you know, in the Globe and Mail or whatever, you know, McLean's magazine, BC Business, wherever you, what's your ideal publication and what's your ideal headline, and without putting your name in the headline, obviously, but of course Google that headline and see who's who's having that conversation already, what publication is telling that story, um, and then and then look into those places where the conversations are happening. And how is your story different to that one that's being told? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

And I think, I think just building on that a little bit is so many people think, oh, well, everybody's doing it. Well, everybody might be doing it, but you're gonna do it different, or everybody might have a similar story, but you're but you're gonna tell it different. You have different emotions, all of that.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and there's enough business out there for all of us. Like to go back to the real estate example, it would be an absolute disaster if everyone in your community wanted to work with you. That would be very stressful. So that's why we have different people that will connect with different, you know, different audiences and be able to help different people. And if you communicate your story clearly and effectively and authentically, your audience will will find you and you know, you'll find them. And there's gonna be lots of people that aren't the right audience, and that's that's totally fine. That's that's great, actually. Yes, yes. Um, so yeah, going out there to figure out where where are the the platforms that could tell your story and who whose trust do you want? Who is your audience and where are they consuming?

SPEAKER_01:

Wow. I have got I got it. I this this podcast has kicked me in the rear. You got me in a totally different direction. And I appreciate, no, I appreciate that because sometimes we need to wake up a little bit. We get sometimes we get complacent in what we're doing, right? You know, oh, this is comfortable or this, you know, this is easy because I already know it. But all of a sudden, you talk to somebody um who knows what they're doing, like you, and all of a sudden it's like, oh yeah, I got a few extra things I can take. I I'm I will be starting. I have I have notes, people. I have notes. So oh good.

SPEAKER_00:

I'm so glad. No, this I I just I think the way that you're sharing your story and another stories is is wonderful. So thank you so much for the conversation. I really enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, thank you, Jen. Well, everybody, we're gonna sign off. So, as I said, all of Jen's information is gonna be in the show notes. Do not hesitate to reach out to her, she's lovely and and extremely helpful. And um, hopefully, we will see you on our next Women Like Me Stories and Business. Take care, everybody. Bye.

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